Orange broadband

...(after Wanadoo became Orange) until Orange decided to "upgrade" their lines to an LLU (Local Loop Unbundling) Split-Line ADSL2 Service instead of the original ADSL line which worked perfectly well with my Thompson Speedtouch Modem AND the TALK-TALK phone line we had signed up to a year ago.

UPDATE 31 MAY 2007: two months and ten days after losing the service, I am finally connected via an ethernet cable to the internet via ...
...our letter telling us that ORANGE were taking over Wanadoo, but that our service would carry on unchanged. We were NOT told that we were paying £3 MORE than ORANGE CUSTOMERS for our Speedtouch (Basic Broadband) service, and the money was simply collected by Direct Debit every month by "Orange Home" instead of "Wanadoo" from my husband's bank account.

We HAD been invited to view the new website, but as my homepage ... more

Sometimes I really wonder why the bigger a company gets, the more worthless the company's service or even Customer Service seems to become.

Do you think it is related to the "Peter Principle" (ie: "in any hierarchy, each member rises to his level of incompetence" for those persons who are unfamiliar with the principle)? I must confess that there are times when that truly seems to be the case!

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This is the story of how our Internet Connection ceased to work "Like Clockwork" when our previous ISP was taken over by ORANGE.

It must be stated, actually, that my "Orange Broadband" ALSO worked fine (after Wanadoo became Orange) until Orange decided to "upgrade" their lines to an LLU (Local Loop Unbundling) Split-Line ADSL2 Service instead of the original ADSL line which worked perfectly well with my Thompson Speedtouch Modem AND the TALK-TALK phone line we had signed up to a year ago.

UPDATE 31 MAY 2007: two months and ten days after losing the service, I am finally connected via an ethernet cable to the internet via my laptop at home ~ as my PC doesn't recognise the ethernet cable, I have bought a wireless adapter on eBay and am awaiting delivery.

My "Current Broadband connection has been established for 12hrs and 21mins" . . . according to the Livebox Inventel page . . . We will have to see what happens next, ~ including the originally promised compensation for loss of service (which I was told to apply for once my internet connection had been re-established). I will update when I have more information.

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Like many other internet customers, my husband first signed up to Freeserve Anytime for a dial-up internet connection in December 2003. At some point in the succeeding months, this was taken over seamlessly by Wanadoo, and, apart from minor changes there was not much difference. The main difficulty with the "dial-up" connection were that if I was on the internet at home, no-one could call us on the landline; as a secondary consideration, again, when Windows tried to upload a security update, the connection would sometimes time-out before completion. The connection was for a maximum of 2 hours at a time (although you could re-dial within a second) and even 2 hours on dial-up speeds was rather slow for some updates to be completed.

A Wanadoo representative easily persuaded my husband that for a very small increase in his monthly fee he could have a broadband connection. The transition to an ADSL SpeedTouch modem (connected and powered via USB) was relatively painless. The password and username were stored on both the PC and the laptop (which were interchangeable on the single modem by means of just plugging the USB into the appropriate machine). When I wanted to use the internet, I just clicked on the desktop icon and then the "connect" button.

I NEVER had to call on Customer Support during the time we were with Freeserve or Wanadoo, and after the first few months never accessed our Freeserve e-mail account (assuming, correctly as it happens, that all it contained was e-mails relating to the account status ~ and as they faithfully took out their subscription money each month without adding extra charges, my husband was satisfied).

My main difficulty for the next three years was a sudden closure of all IE windows spontaneously on regular occasions, which I naturally assumed was a result of having too little hard drive capability (5.99GB is not very much when you are running Windows XP Professional). Clearing all Temporary Internet files and excess cookies (which are little files placed on the computer by outside websites to ease navigation from page to page) from the hard drive and reopening Internet Explorer usually solved that problem, so requesting external support wasn't really necessary.

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Fast Forward until 21st March 2007.

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We had had our letter telling us that ORANGE were taking over Wanadoo, but that our service would carry on unchanged. We were NOT told that we were paying £3 MORE than ORANGE CUSTOMERS for our Speedtouch (Basic Broadband) service, and the money was simply collected by Direct Debit every month by "Orange Home" instead of "Wanadoo" from my husband's bank account.

We HAD been invited to view the new website, but as my homepage is my Ciao! profile page, and I have several HOTMAIL accounts, we hadn't realised the need to do anything. In fact, everything had worked PERFECTLY, initially, with Orange Broadband (apart from the poor communication of possible options) until that fateful day . . .

I tried to connect to the internet via my SpeedTouch Modem shortcut as usual.

The connection was attempted when I clicked the button: the remote computer connected, all devices in the chain were connected, and then it tried to verify username and password.

. . . . . . and tried again.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . and again . . . .
. . . nine times . . .

. . . before giving me Error: 0721 Could not connect to remote computer. . .

. . . . . . . . . . . . WHERE HAD MY INTERNET CONNECTION GONE? . . . . . . . .

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I didn't have a telephone number to contact Orange Technical Support, and had long ago mislaid any Freeserve or Wanadoo contact numbers, never having needed them.

I called in at the local Orange Shop on 24th March to see if they could help me. As they do not deal with Internet there, and there wasn't a phone they could let me call Customer Service with in the shop (as you need to "have your computer on and ready" for technical support to help you), THEY were unable to solve my problems.

They did, however, give me two numbers to try ~ one from my Orange mobile, and one from a landline.

Thank you, kind sirs.

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When I got home, I tried the numbers I had been given. The short-code one didn't work on my ORANGE phone because I have a PAYG phone rather than a Contract Orange phone. Never mind. I tried the other number, and got through. I selected all the options in turn, as requested, on my keypad and got through to Technical Support somewhere that English did not appear to be a "first language" (was I just unlucky that first attempt? The subsequent technical support persons HAVE all spoken English reasonably well).
*Ah ~ I have discovered they have three call centres, Rotherham, Middlesboro and India.*(edited 2 May)

This first "Technical Support" advisor told me that I must have typed my name and password incorrectly. I told him that that was impossible as I had not used my username or password for over three years as they were saved on the computer. It did seem strange that it attempted to verify the username and password so many times, though. Surely that couldn't be the problem, though, as the Error 0721 did not SAY "incorrect username or password" ~ but rather "could not connect to remote computer" which appeared to be a fault at their end server.

Without trying to ascertain further details, such as the line and account this related to, or the account holder's name or details, the "assistant" shouted to me that it MUST be my fault for typing the wrong password, therefore he couldn't help me and he hung up on me. Unfortunately I did not manage to get his name.

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My husband spoke to the next advisor with me, and put me on the account as a "third party" to the account, giving my full name and birthdate details so the advisors would deal with me alone as he was getting tired of having to pass the phone back and forth between us to discuss the problems with the advisors. It was taking long enough already on a "non-free" National Rate phone call.

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PROGRESS SO FAR:

1) Technical support tried to talk me through uninstalling and manually re-installing my SpeedTouch modem and internet connection.

2) Technical support have tested the line (MULTIPLE times, for 24 hours at a time, if I can believe the various persons to whom I have spoken).

3) Technical support have "identified" faults on the line, which engineers have been working on ~ in one case for over 12 hours (started work just as my conversation with the support person began, so he could not access my details: Could I call back after 7am, please, tomorrow?), yet, when I rang back after 11am the next day, the fault was still being worked on, AND other members were able to access the security details of the account to verify myself, and check whether other notes had yet been applied to the account, during that "down" time.

4) I was told that the lines had just been improved ~ and that "according to BT engineers, were now too FAST for my SpeedTouch modem" so I would need to "upgrade" to their LiveBox wireless and Ethernet connection. This was to be at a lower cost than before, and would entail my agreeing to an additional six month contract (normally 12 months, but I was a good customer they were trying to retain . . . ) [I have since spoken to a BT Engineer who has informed me that my Thompson Speedtouch Modem can handle speeds up to 64MB, not just the original 2MB or faster 8MB ~ and that the problem is not the speed but the LLU split line Orange have introduced on the line which is ADSL2 rather than the standard ADSL Wanadoo were using. (updated 10 May 2007)]

5) The Livebox installation CD had a fault, so they sent me a replacement ~(a SpeedTouch modem installation CD which took a week to arrive and then was the wrong CD). They have ordered a NEW replacement CD.

6) I was talked through a manual installation of the LiveBox, including the configuration and verification of the account, on an Ethernet (wired) connection.

7) The LiveBox thinks it has a connection but it still cannot connect to the internet. The Ethernet connection with the laptop was successful. UPDATE: finally have internet connection after two months and ten days offline. l have lost my connection several times since, but only for a few hours each time. SPEED? 2.2 Mbps.

8) When I had been without internet access for over a month, it was suggested that a "temporary" dial-up PAYG (through slow modem) would be better than nothing, and I was given two numbers for the "Dial-up team" to set about getting a "temporary" dial-up connection while I wait for the LiveBox to work. One was a "national rate" number while the other was an 0906- (premium rate ~ 50p / minute) number. The national rate number I was given referred me back to the Premium rate number.

9) A call designed to set up a temporary dial-up connection had to go through this line, and took about 15minutes (£7.50 minimum), but this connection was not successful as the Technical Support tried to use the same username as the broadband connection.

10) Another advisor gave me a different 0870- (national rate) number and told me to try Option 2 for "dial-up" (non-technical) support. This advisor set me up with a PAYG dial-up account in a different username ~ cost of internet usage 4p / minute daytime; 2p / minute evenings; 1p / minute at weekends.

11) Another non-technical "Technical advisor" has advised me to ring back between 9am to 5pm tomorrow (1st May), when someone is more likely to be able to help me . . . and that took nearly 15 minutes . . .

12) I was informed on 1st May that the connection problem is definitely not the fault of Orange by the Technical Advisor I spoke to, and I should contact BT as it is their lines which are the problem. They are apparently sending the signal, and I am receiving it, but the signal is being blocked at the return Server as BT "MUST" be doing maintenance work. I will not be able to connect to Orange Internet Broadband until the "BT Server" in my area is no longer down.
[Funny, my neighbour has a BT Internet Router, and HE has an ADSL server working OK . . . in fact, a BT engineer told me yesterday that the fault is quite probably the LLU split line which Orange have introduced in order to "encourage" people onto the LIVEBOX, which uses the ADSL2 technology (edited 10 May 2007)]

13) This same Technical Advisor has told me that as "It is not Orange's Fault" I am unlikely to get any refund or compensation, that when another advisor said she had ordered an extra Ethernet cable for me "free of charge" she couldn't have, and didn't, as they "Only supply ONE ethernet cable, and NO wireless adapters" free-of charge.

14) FURTHER INSTRUCTIONS? Once or twice a day, detatch the power supply to the LiveBox, wait 10 seconds, and re-plug-in. The LiveBox will be able to detect new settings of the server, and when the server is back on, I would finally get internet access. Apparently, ORANGE only guarantee that they will send a signal, NOT that you will have INTERNET ACCESS . . . the saga continues . . . [I have been advised to contact OFCOM, as the original contract for Internet Access has not been fulfilled, so I am legally entitled to both a refund of subscriptions paid AND compensation; also that the fault appears to be the Local Loop Unbundling (LLU) which was installed by ORANGE between 20-23 March 2007 on my line (last update: 10 May 2007)].

15) FINALLY HAVE Livebox INTERNET; from 6th June, my VoIP has been active as well. Have made four local 01- phone calls which should have been free, but which appear on my "up-to-date"online 2-6-07 to 1-7-07 Statement as charges (pre VAT). I have called Customer Services, who referred me to technical support who, after verifying service to Livebox is normal, have referred me back to Customer Services.
I will receive a "Goodwill" payment of two months' rental @ £17.99 for the time offline; to receive any compensation for extra costs incurred l will have to apply further, possibly through OFCOM.

16) Have now spoken to a Senior Supervisor, Simon Jackson, who has promised to ensure I get the service l was told I was getting when l signed up to the LiveBox Unlimited Broadband. He is sending me a USB wireless adapter for my PC and my calls will be free 24/7 to the appropriate numbers as detailed on the www.orange.co.uk website. l have slightly improved my ratings, and will UPDATE further when I am fully back online with my PC as well as the laptop.

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EXTRA COSTS INCURRED . . .

For over two months, I tried and tried to get my Broadband working, using every suggestion put to me by the varied and numerous technical advisors. The cost of this was either an 0870- (National-Rate) number or an 07973- (mobile phone) number. When I was able to use the mobile number, I used my inclusive any-network any-time minutes on my 3-phone; this was only possible to speak to the Broadband advisors; when l was unable to connect this way l used the national rate number.

Average time before connection to live advisor: 5 minutes
Average length of call: 15 - 30 minutes
Total time WASTED (?) : 900+ minutes . . .

"Dial-up" technical support is through an 0906- (premium rate) number costing 50p / minute.
[A call designed to set up a temporary dial-up connection had to go through this line, and took about 15minutes (£7.515 +VAT), but this connection was not successful as the Technical Support person (at a call centre in India) tried to use the same username as the broadband connection, which could not be used.] A dial-up connection is charged a minimum "connection" fee even when no connection is possible every time a connection is attempted.

Dial-up customer services are through a different 0870- National Rate number. Three additional separate calls totalling about 1/2hour (£2.815 +VAT) were required to set up a working PAYG Dial-up internet connection.

DIAL-UP INTERNET COSTS until Broadband re-connected.

We paid by Direct Debit to Orange Home £17.99 on 16th March and 16th April, these will be refunded as a "Goodwill" payment I have been informed today, 22 June as Service has Resumed . . .

Whether any further appropriate compensation may also be forthcoming is in doubt following my conversation on 1st May and to Customer Services today . . . perhaps a conversation with OFCOM may help resolve the situation . . .

I know it seems ungrateful now that I'm re-connected ~ but I'm only connected through my laptop, at home, which gives me multiple and skipped letters, and sometimes missed capital letters when I type ~
so . . .

Right Now,

I STILL just wish I had my WANADOO BROADBAND back . . .

© 2007 jesi ~ ! ♥♥ !

ps: my internet icon now just says 'connected' but, this morning, for the first time, l had 8Mbps ~ for a glorious hour or so before losing connection ~ l have been averaging 1.37Mbps out of the suggested 2.2Mbps (according to screentest.com), and l didn't test this 8Mbps, but my pages loaded and changed pretty quickly, while it lasted . . . 

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