As The National Blood Transfusion Service has NEVER said, "Merry Christmas To All Our Bleeders&...
As The National Blood Transfusion Service has NEVER said, "Merry Christmas To All Our Bleeders"
Member since:08.10.2000
Reviews:479
Members who trust:178
April 2008
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Two years down the line, I remain convinced that, foibles excepted, the Topfield 5800 remains the clear leader in its field, so much so that I've bought second one before they stop making them in favour of the new 5810T.
*************************************************************** I'd owned a PVR before; the excellent Humax 8000PVRT, designed solely for Freeview digital terrestrial TV, but since buying it, two things happened.
a) I got fed up with paying £19.50/month to Sky, just for a load of dross intermingled with the free channels I can get elsewhere and
b) My TV started to become very troublesome, and any replacement I was to buy was likely to be a flat screen monitor requiring outboard tuners. The Humax's single tuner for Freeview would then have been a limitation.
To put the icing on the cake, I was using my Humax to demonstrate Freeview at a friend's house, and she was so enthralled not only with the extra gains over the 'analogue big 5', but with the Humax's extra features that she started making noises along the lines of 'let me know if you're selling it'.
Therefore, with the safe backing of a market for the old gear, I set about looking for something a bit more flexible.
This next PVR was going to need two tuners, one for recording, and one for watching at the very least.
There were actually a few of these around even two years back; Pace, Thomson, Digifusion and indeed Humax again being a few names that spring to mind. However, anyone like me, with at least one ear to the various nerdy forums will have picked up that some of these were proving quite 'buggy', and the subject of frequent firmware updates.
One machine, which came through all this with shining or rather 'shini-ER' colours, having some vexations of its own, was the Topfield 5800PVR. Not a common household brand, but, like Humax, a name well known in Satellite Set-Top box circles (just not SKY set-top box circles though).
FIRST IMPRESSIONS
"It doesn't look very space age does it?", being built in a typical 70's style silver box with a black acrylic front panel? For the best part of 300 smackers at the time, I was expecting something a bit less 'generic' looking. (Nowadays, it's more like £160)It was about the same width as my old Sky+ box, so at least it's not 'full hi-fi size'.
However, was far cry from the slim mirror-finished Humax, but I had to keep telling myself that it was all for the best really.
Incidentally, there's also a newer matte 'Black Panther' version, for those that like their A/V equipment a little on the 'dark side' at the same price.
CONNECTING IT UP
Initially, this is much like a VCR. You run your aerial cable into it, and back out to the TV - there's a slight complication that you also have add a (supplied) patch lead in to connect both tuners into the 'daisy-chain'; not very tidy, but heh, it's round the back! My photo of the rear panel will show this on the left.
At first I thought that maybe they could have embodied this patch connection within the body of the thing instead of this 'amateurish' lash-up, but there is a method in their untidy madness. Having a dedicated input to each tuner allows those living in a poor signal strength area to apply an amplifier and splitter to their aerial feed, and then supply each tuner with its own cable of equal signal strength.
The rear panel has a daunting array
of other connections. There are two SCART sockets, one for the TV and one for a VCR. The VCR socket can also 'pass-through' a signal, say from a Sky box, which is a boon if your TV's only got one SCART socket.
For TVs without any SCART lead, the Topfield can recreate a TV frequency signal (RF output), to which you then tune the TVs next spare channel.
There's also an s-video socket, most likely used by those that channel everything through an A/V amplifier, or home cinema set-up.
Sound is taken care of in one of three ways. Firstly, the SCART sockets carry it in stereo, then you've got two conventional 'phono' plugs also for analogue stereo, and finally, there's a digital optical output for connection to a home cinema amplifier.
More interestingly, there's also a USB 2.0 and 9-pin serial port, "affording", as Gerald Hoffnung once said, "delightful prospects", more of which later.
SET-UP
It's difficult for me to be specific about the set-up method, since it depends largely to what you connect it. However, once you've got some kind of picture emanating from the Topfield, you're ready to set it up via its menus. First up comes tuning - naturally. Suffice it to say that scanning for channels works like a charm, especially if you are confident that the digital TV signal strength was already up to standard. Do check your postcode on the Freeview web-site before embarking from scratch, or at least check if your neighbours are receiving it OK (or get a mug to bring their kit round, feigning interest in buying it from them!).
During installation, you get the chance to set the output of the TV SCART to either 'Composite, 'S-Video' or 'RGB', the latter being a split of the three colours (red, green and blue), which is a sizable improvement using six wires compared to 'Composite's' mere two, and S-Video's four wires. Basically, you find out what's the best picture standard that your TV's SCART socket will stand and set it to that.
Sadly, the output to the VCR SCART is limited to Composite, since not many VCRs can accept anything better.
WHAT CAN IT DO?
Well, for a start, there are those twin tuners, which can be used to record two programmes simultaneously, or record one and watch another, or watch two as a 'picture-in-picture' arrangement. Under rarer circumstances, it can even record two programmes and STILL let you watch another.
Sounds impossible? Well, consider that one of the main reasons for launching digital terrestrial television was to multiplex several TV stations down one radio frequency, unlike the one-to-one arrangements for analogue. It therefore follows, for example that stations like BBC1 and BBC2 are part of the same multiplex using the same radio frequency.
Let's say you set a timer to record BBC1 from 8.00 pm to 9.00 pm, and ITV1 from 8.15 pm to 9.30 pm. Thanks to the twin tuners, this can still be done, despite the fact that BBC1 and ITV1 are situated on different multiplexes. What does take you by surprise is that you can still 'watch BBC2, as it forms part of the same multiplex as BBC 1 and doesn't require a third tuner to do so. Therefore any multiplex being used by a tuner to record something is fair game when it comes to watching the rest of its channels.
Something else the Toppy can do which many other 'Freeview' boxes can't, is to receive TopUpTV; the added-on pay channels. Ever the pessimist, I assumed that each tuner would need its own subscription card, but no.
Having lost E4 to Freeview, I wasn't sure whether there's really anything I'd want on TopUpTV, but as an experiment, I took it on; the advantage it has over Sky is that you're only tied into a month-by-month contract, with no minimum period, other than a month of course. Oh yes, and it was £12/month cheaper!
The subscription card only gets used either when you are
a) actually watching a TUTV channel live, or
b) when playing back a recording of a TUTV programme
Since you're not likely to try playing back two TUTV recordings at once, you only need the one smart card installed. Therefore, there's nothing to stop you recording two TUTV channels at once despite only having paid the one subscription. - it's how many you're watching that counts.
Compared to the single tuner Humax, which merely 'did what it said on the tin', the twin tuners add a new dimension, not only in flexibility, but also in how much you need to get to grips with. To be honest, the original manual is not of the best, despite its 69 pages, all in English (well, sort of Korenglish really!), and to a certain extent, I'm glad I already knew what a PVR was. At least then I knew there were channels to be tuned and hard drives to format. The other problem with the original manual, is that it was not sufficiently up to date to embody the latest features from the last firmware upgrade, like the sleep timer, hence the need to find a web forum and read it. View it more like a draft discussion document rather than a bible.
WHAT ELSE CAN IT DO? AH, YES, THAT USB CONNECTION
As well as recording directly from Freeview and TUTV, (oh yes, and don't forget digital radio) it can be used as an MP3 music 'jukebox'. That's one of the reasons for the USB connection. From various sites, including my supplier, www.turbosat.com, you can download a transfer utility called Altair which looks like a twin version of Windows Explorer, from whence you can drag'n'drop files, into the Toppy's own hard drive. (There's now a more integrated utility called Topset 2.0)
With 160 gigabytes (now 250 gigabytes) of disk space to play with, nominally giving 80 (or 125) hours TV, I'm sure I could spare some disk space to put 'ripped' versions of my compilation CDs on there, thereby freeing up yet more lounge space. You navigate your mp3 music files using the same 'archive' screen as you do for your recorded TV programmes - you just shift to another directory first.
At this stage, the Toppy is starting to feel more like a highly specialised PC than a TV tuner, especially since it's unique amongst PVRs in being able to run 'TAPs', which are 'third party applications' designed mostly by enthusiasts for the Topfield. The vast majority are freeware.
"MYSTUFF" TO THE RESCUE
What this really means is that, if you're tired of the existing Electronic Programme Guide (EPG) and its inability to "pad" a recording at the front and back to do away with those annoying premature cut-offs, you can download a TAP called Mystuff which is superb. It not only works around the fact that the Topfield was not able to maintain an accurately-adjusted list of timers (to allow for programming changes) but it also has a superb way of setting an equivalent of series timers, called a Control Timer. This lifts the Topfield from the quagmire of mere time-dependant timers (i.e they could end up being wrong just like to old days of VCRs) to that of an "event-specific timer", that is to say it looks for further occurrences of a programme name and sets timers for them. Every hour
Pictures of Topfield TF5800T
General frontal view
it checks the EPG, and once again at 2.30 am for good measure. Any alterations to the schedule reflect straight away in the timer list. Come to think of it, it's worth setting a Control Timer even for single programmes. This hourly checking is "harvested" and filed on the hard disk. This also gets around Freeview's other major annoyance - waiting for the EPG to "populate" whenever you've just changed channels. There's always something there, at most an hour out of date.
This facility has enabled me to set a timer for every Grand Prix and practice session, merely by setting a Control Timer to look for "Grand Prix" on ITV1 since they all have those two words in their titles. I could even leave it there for next year, assuming BBC use a similar phraseology.
PERMANENT RECORDINGS?
Another use for the USB port is to transfer TV recordings to a PC, from where they can be edited (deleting commercials etc) before converting to a DVD for archive purposes. That of course presupposes that you can find anything you want to keep! This is a bit fiddly, since the file format needs to be processed from its native ".rec" format to mpeg files. A DVD authoring suite called VideoReDo is my favoured method.
ISN'T IT NOISY?
No, since they moved over to using Samsung Spinpointhard-drives, recognised as exceptionally quiet, it is VERY quiet, and there's no PC-style fan either. In any case, you can even opt to turn the hard-drive off unless it's recording or playing back, but then you lose the ability to pause live TV.
PAUSE LIVE TV?
Yes, honest. By running the hard disk full time, the machine builds up a buffer of what you've been watching for up to an hour (now extendable to 2) on any one channel. Not only can you pause live TV (whilst you fend off JWs at the door) but you can also rewind live TV back to when you switched on, subject to the maximum.
Having 'rewound' back to the beginning of your programme, you can even make it into a permanent recording by hitting the record button. I find the pause facility really convenient especially when watching commercial channels. I let them run on ahead whilst I pause the machine for about 15 minutes, giving me time to do other 'stuff'. Then I play it back, zapping the ads in 2-minute chunks thanks again to Mystuff ability to used the coloured buttons for 3 differing lengths of leaps forward (and one backwards). Sorry ITV.
This machine will also do a fast-reverse AND 'SLO-MO'.
WATCHING LIVE TV
Change channels in the normal way. A useful 'i' button gives extended information on what you're watching and to what's on next. You can run a Picture-In-Picture of your last and current channels, moving the minor picture around the screen. You can even swap the status of major and minor pictures.
MAKING A TIMED RECORDING
Select 'Guide' on the remote control. Scroll down the on-screen display and click on the desired programme with the 'record' button. You can alter the attributes of the recording later, or if using Mystuff, make a Control Timer of it now or later.
WATCHING RECORDINGS
Easy-peasy. Press the 'Archive' button and choose your programme from the list. Then use the 'transport' keys in much the same way you would for a VCR on playback. Playback quality is identical to live, thanks to the fact that it merely records the digital format off the air. Playback can also continue whilst recordings are currently being made, in fact you can even start playing back a recording that's not yet finished - how's that for impatient?
RADIO
At last, you get something with which to schedule radio recordings, in the same way, using the EPG. Needless to say, playback quality is superb, and if I read it right, higher quality than actual DAB. Unfortunately, you only get what's available from your fixed position, unlike DAB portable radios.
THOSE BUGS?
Personally, I've not come across them. It was reputed that the Toppy would make the odd silent recording, or no recording at all, but it's not happened to me in several months extensive use of the timer. Maybe having glitch-free reception is the key, plus making sure that it was delivered with the latest firmware upgrade, which it was.
AVAILIBILITY
Like its predecessor, the Humax, the "Toppy" is not a High Street name, being well known in satellite hardware circles but not Dixons. Both the Humax and the Topfield are now sufficiently mainstream to have made it onto John Lewis' shelves. They have one official importer in Britain, www.turbosat.com, although other web-based retailers like Unbeatable also sell it, as a perusal of Kelkoo will show.
I remain surprised that with such a fistful of features, and with other twin-tuner PVRs getting such mixed press, that it found it so hard to become a household name.
Turbosat gave practically return of post service, and along with the www.toppy.org.uk site they remain the best place to find the latest software upgrades.
Nowadays, you may find the odd reduction here and there, but prepare to part with nearly £200 including carriage. Of course, if you feel that your next move will be into LCD/Plasmaflat screen monitors, then the Topfield could be the kiddy to satisfy all your digital terrestrial TV tuner needs, although the newer 5810 has the advantage of an up-scaled digital HDMI output (though unlike Sky, it isn't actually HD)
CAVEATS
You do need a good signal strength, preferably one that doesn't fluctuate - it wasn't for nothing that the now-defunct OnDigital was offering £40 aerial upgrades to those who had fallen for the 'digital TV through an aerial' routine, although you'll note they didn't say 'through YOUR aerial'. Mine had been upgraded during this era, so I can reliably get 75% signal strength and 100% picture quality (both of these are shown in the information box that flashes up whenever you change channels). Personally I'd be more worried about the lack of 100% picture quality, as the tuners display some forbearance with the signal strength. You may get lucky, and have no problems, but don't just assume that because the Freeview postcode checker says it will all be OK, that it'll work flawlessly straight out of the box. There again, don't just give up either. My old machine, now happily installed at my friends house wasn't too promising on day one (isn't that always the case when you're trying to sell something?). However, I remade all her aerial connections for her, one of which was decidedly loose, and jacked up the signal strength by about 10% in the process. It's very easy to neglect decent aerial connections, both when making them up, and probably when dusting too.
To get full advantage from the Toppy and its USB port, you need to bring it to a PC, or, if a laptop is available, the PC to the Toppy. This enables you to update not only its software in advance of any 'over-the-air' updates which are timetabled along with those for every other set-top-box maker, but to add 'TAPs', and download MP3 music files.
RECOMMENDED MODIFICATIONS
Whilst it does work "out of the box", then if this is your bag, the Humax 9200T is probably for you. If you like the idea of something that you can customise, then the Topfield is unique. It's a little like being a "Mac" owner in a sea of PCs, or perhaps given its appeal to "hobbyists" a PC in a sea of Macs!.Having dabbled with many TAPS, I've settled on the following for my current setup.
"Mystuff" - This is a hugely improved EPG medium, giving the ability to record TV series like a Sky+ box.
"MEISearch" - This compliments Mystuff and adds the facilty to do such searches of the EPG information as pulling out lists of Movies or Documetaries, with the capability of setting timers there and then.
"TF5000Display" - this makes the front display more useful, i.e. channel "P001" becomes "BBC 1"
"Power Manager" - This allows a shut-off time to be set in case you forget and go to bed. It will however wait for any recording in progress.
"Accurate Bookmarking" - Since most recording are "padded" at start and finish to allow for incorrect timers, this "bookmarks the "actual" starts and finishes, making it easy to zoom ahead to the beginning.
There are literally dozens of others, but it pays not to overload the memory otherwise it might jeopardise its ability to record two programmes at once whilst allowing you to watch something else. Not all of them have to be made "resident" though and can be turned on and off at will.
I'm waiting for my second machine to be delivered before I try "iGuide" an alternative to MyStuff. This has the ability to attach a cellphone so that you can send it remote timing requests by text from anywhere in the world! I'm not sure what I'll do with this new-fangled functionality, since copies of The Radio Times are a trifle hard to come by in Andalusia!
RECOMMENDED READING
Basically, anything but the old official manual, which was truly awful.Try the forum at www.toppy.org.uk - this is a great source of 'newbie' Q&A, plus links to downloading TAPs, you'll even see the progress of one Chris Green there, although modesty prevents me from saying who that really is.
When the time comes to actually buy one, I found www.turbosat.com second to none both in speed of delivery and for the comprehensive manner of their web-site. They may not be the absolute in cheapness, but there's not a lot in it.
CONCLUSION
Glad I bought it? Yes, unreservedly. In addition to all its little tricks thanks to the twin tuners, it has enabled me to rethink my hi-fi rack. Combined with the ousting of the Sky box, I'm now down to a 5-channel amplifier, the Toppy and my DVD recorder, which also doubles as my DVD and CD players. The VCR got given the boot last year.
Picture quality is excellent, the features are too many to shake a stick at and it's whisper-quiet.
Top notch, Topfield.
How helpful would this review be to a person making a buying decision? Rating guidelines
After reading your extremely thorough review, I have decided to part with my hard-earned cash and give the Topfield a whirl.
congratulations on such an extensive and informative review!
Mayclair 30.10.2005 15:40
An informative well written review....gina.
aogg 02.10.2005 15:43
Brilliant review. I'd been looking at this box for a while now and this has convinced me thta I'm on the right track.
exceptional by (20%):
very helpful by (80%):
